Before Stacy Bernstein and her All Better Co. co-founder built a product, they built a partnership — starting with the one conversation most co-founders skip.
Stacy Bernstein ran her first company with two partners she never had a hard conversation with. No exit plan, no defined roles, and eventually an artist stuck doing budgets while Stacy took a call with Target’s CMO from her car, breastfeeding a three-week-old and asking herself what she was doing. When she started All Better Co. with co-founder Merav, the first thing they set up was their divorce: what happens if this doesn’t work?
Stacy and Everett get specific about what makes the second partnership hold. Stacy and Merav sit in opposite silos (operations for Merav, brand for Stacy) and follow a rule for disagreements: say your piece, and if it’s the other person’s silo and they stand firm, you acquiesce. They also cover why two creatives need a grownup in the room, how partners in different seasons of life have to talk about it out loud, and the payoff of getting the partnership right — nine months of pure customer research that surfaced a white space in the first aid aisle nobody had touched in decades.
If you have a co-founder, or are about to choose one, this is the conversation to hear first. Subscribe to Small Business Unscripted wherever you listen.
What You'll Learn:
Chapters:
(00:00) Introduction
(00:56) Career, Quality of Life & Money
(01:38) Lessons from an Athlete's Mindset
(03:21) NHL Roots & Storytelling
(06:35) Scaling Challenges & Knowing When to Exit
(08:57) Founder Partnerships & Tough Conversations
(14:43) Pivoting into CPG
(15:35) The Idea Behind All Better Co.
(17:02) Why Everyday First Aid Needed Innovation
(18:29) Naming All Better Co.
(19:37) Competing Against Industry Giants
(22:28) Big Vision, BHAGs & Acquisition
(25:05) Dividing Founder Responsibilities
(27:29) Pivoting with Purpose
(29:47) Celebrating the Wins
(32:15) Founder Advice & Taking Risks
Stacy's Highlights:
“The first thing I did with my partner now, Merav — the first thing we talked about was our divorce. That was the first thing we actually set up: what if it doesn’t work?”
“If I disagree on something that’s in Merav’s silo and I say my piece, and if it’s something that she’s willing to say, ‘No, I stand firm on this,’ then I acquiesce. That’s your silo, and we have to be willing to sit in that.”
“Yes, you can have two creatives, but if you have two real creatives, then you need a grownup in the room.”
Connect:
Connect with Everett: http://linkedin.com/in/everettksands
Connect with Stacy: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stacy-bernstein-1b59a328/
Learn more about the All Better Co.: https://allbetterco.com/
Continue the conversation: smallbusinessunscripted.com
Learn more about Lendistry: lendistry.com
[00:00:00] Stacy: You have to go into a partnership with many things. [Everett: Yeah.] I mean, the first thing I did with my partner now, Merav — the first thing we talked about — was our divorce.
[00:00:08] Everett: Yeah,
[00:00:08] Stacy: yeah. That was the first thing we actually set up. [Everett: Yeah.] It was like, "Okay, great. This—"
[00:00:12] Everett: What if it doesn't work?
[00:00:13] Stacy: What if—
[00:00:13] Everett: —it doesn't? Yeah.
[00:00:14] Stacy: What if it doesn't work? Yeah. And that's not a conversation that I had had with that partner.
[00:00:17] Everett: Gotcha.
[00:00:18] Stacy: And that made it really challenging, and it wasn't working.
[00:00:21] Everett: That's Stacy Bernstein, co-founder and chief brand officer for All Better Co. Stacy's a three-time entrepreneur. She went from Division 1 [00:00:30] athlete to founder of an amazing brand.
You'll hear great stories from her about her entrepreneurial journey and all the different things that help her thrive. I'm Everett Sands, your host and CEO of Lendistry. This is Small Business Unscripted. Let's get into it.
Welcome to Small Business Unscripted, Stacy.
[00:00:53] Stacy: Thank you. I'm—
[00:00:53] Everett: —so happy for you to be here.
[00:00:54] Stacy: I'm so excited to be here.
[00:00:56] Everett: Yeah. So I always ask entrepreneurs or our guests this [00:01:00] one question — there's no wrong answer. So why don't you put these in order for me today: career, compensation, or quality of life?
[00:01:08] Stacy: Career probably. Quality of life — I think there's always this conversation of work-life balance.
[00:01:18] Everett: Absolutely. Yeah.
[00:01:19] Stacy: So I can talk more about that later, but it's important to me, quality of life. So important to me. But right now my career kind of needs to get me there.
[00:01:27] Everett: Yeah.
[00:01:27] Stacy: And then compensation — not [00:01:30] because I don't want it. I just don't want to do what I'm doing for the money.
[00:01:37] Everett: Yeah. No, that's great. That's great. So speaking of career, you were a Division 1 soccer player.
[00:01:41] Stacy: I was.
[00:01:42] Everett: And then a coach.
[00:01:43] Stacy: I was.
[00:01:44] Everett: Tell us a little bit about that, and how does that translate to small business today for you?
[00:01:47] Stacy: I'm sure you hear this from a ton of athletes, but I feel like my athletic career is everything. It's shaped totally who I am as a human being. I still do it [00:02:00] today competitively. And I will say I love all sports, but I am a team sport person.
[00:02:06] Everett: Yeah. Okay.
[00:02:07] Stacy: Always want to be on a team.
[00:02:08] Everett: Okay.
[00:02:08] Stacy: And I think that speaks to who I am as a person. I thrive on collaboration.
[00:02:13] Everett: Yeah.
[00:02:13] Stacy: And through my college career, it wasn't without adversity. I suffered a really strange, bizarre syndrome in my legs that was not very known or talked about at the time.
[00:02:25] Everett: Okay.
[00:02:25] Stacy: And I had to undergo surgery early. I was told it would take probably nine months [00:02:30] to get back. I got back at four months. And so I think just all of those things — resiliency, determination, mindset, outlook, being able to rely on folks and knowing when to lead and when to follow. I mean, I could just go on and on about it.
[00:02:49] Everett: Totally get it.
[00:02:49] Stacy: Even when I coach — I say to the kids that I coach, "How you show up on the field is how you're going to show up in life."
[00:02:56] Everett: Yeah.
[00:02:57] Stacy: Right? That grit, that determination, that [00:03:00] desire, the ability to support your teammates.
[00:03:02] Everett: Yeah.
[00:03:03] Stacy: And I think that's about character, and sports definitely gave me that.
[00:03:08] Everett: Awesome. We're going to get into resilience and grit a little bit more as we continue the conversation, but let's keep going with your career so we can make sure we understand a little bit better. So, you had a marketing agency?
[00:03:19] Stacy: I did.
[00:03:19] Everett: Tell us a little bit about that agency.
[00:03:21] Stacy: Yeah, I'm going to step back even one more second, because right after school I actually had my dream job [00:03:30] — which was at the National Hockey League.
[00:03:30] Everett: Oh, wow. Okay.
[00:03:30] Stacy: And that actually, though — well, originally I thought I wanted to be a sports agent.
[00:03:35] Everett: Okay.
[00:03:35] Stacy: And then I interned for one.
[00:03:38] Everett: Turns out that's not that.
[00:03:39] Stacy: And so I went to work for the league in New York, and that's really where my desire to tell stories in marketing developed. I was in a department called Fan Development, and hockey was just starting to hit the Sun Belt. And so we really had to build this awareness around the sport.
And so it was storytelling, and I got to [00:04:00] create tournaments and experiences to bring people something I still believe in — when you have an experience with a brand that's meaningful, then you create real connection, and typically loyalists. So that's really then, moving into after I spent some time coaching, going into my company, Crafting Community.
[00:04:22] Everett: So, okay, so you go from hockey into marketing.
[00:04:24] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:04:25] Everett: Talk about that transition.
[00:04:26] Stacy: Yeah, so I had a company called Crafting Community, which I ran [00:04:30] with two other incredible women. We didn't really know where our roles were going to be. We just had this idea of bringing families together through art and recreation — right? Two things our culture really needs.
[00:04:43] Everett: Yeah. Huge.
[00:04:43] Stacy: Um, one of my partners is a fine artist, and the other one a marketer, and so we kind of decided on our silos. And I became actually much more operational than I wanted to be, but it taught me a lot. I was managing budget, a [00:05:00] lot of our relationships with our partners.
And the idea — I'll give you an example. So if we were working with Vans, let's say.
[00:05:09] Neil: Mm-hmm.
[00:05:09] Stacy: At our events, we would bring Vans in, and maybe Vans would donate 30 pairs of sneakers, and then we would bring in a fine artist.
[00:05:20] Everett: Mm.
[00:05:20] Stacy: So, like — a Claire Crespo or another — we actually brought in at one point Mr. Tattoo.
[00:05:25] Everett: Okay.
[00:05:26] Stacy: And he came in, and so the kids one day learned [00:05:30] airbrushing. They designed their own sneakers.
[00:05:32] Everett: Yeah.
[00:05:33] Stacy: And then they took the box that it came in, because we wanted to repurpose it, and with Claire, they made dioramas. We had adults and kids sitting next to each other.
[00:05:42] Everett: Oh, interesting.
[00:05:43] Stacy: So now you have this experience where you're sitting with your daughter. You think you can never do this, but you're with Mr. Tattoo, and he's teaching you how to airbrush something cool on your Vans. And then the next day you have this experience with your daughter, having done it together.
You're going to remember that. [00:06:00] You're going to hold onto that. And you've made something.
[00:06:02] Everett: Yeah.
[00:06:03] Stacy: So we kind of took that and amplified it. And so we went around the country. We had our bespoke event doing it.
[00:06:10] Everett: Yeah.
[00:06:10] Stacy: And we used that event to show brands what we could do.
So by doing that, for example, we wound up landing a campaign with Zappos at the time. And we did some work for them in Austin. We landed some work with Target when they were working on some conceptual ideas — [00:06:30] again, for them, still, how to engage their consumer.
[00:06:33] Everett: Yeah. I get it. That's interesting. Okay, so that business lasted about seven years.
[00:06:38] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:06:38] Everett: And why did that business close?
[00:06:40] Stacy: I think on the macro, we were a little bit ahead of our time.
[00:06:45] Everett: Okay.
[00:06:46] Stacy: Experiential concepts were probably not there yet, and the making space — truly the DIY space — kind of kicked off a little bit after.
[00:06:54] Everett: Yeah.
[00:06:55] Stacy: It's an incredibly difficult business to scale. We [00:07:00] became kind of an events company, but that's not really what we wanted to do. We wanted to do more, like campaigns, right? My partner also did some work with Nike, and she would build installments.
And so I think we wanted more of that, because these events started taking us away from our families, and they're a lot of work, and production is so expensive. So the scaling piece of it, and ultimately, my partner, who was an artist — we had to focus so much on the [00:07:30] business that she wasn't able to do the thing that she loved, which was making things.
[00:07:35] Everett: Yeah.
[00:07:35] Stacy: I wanted to build things, and I was stuck over here on budgets and stuff. And I think, the seasons of our life — throughout this journey, I had three kids. I had three kids in five years, which I look back and I'm like, "How did I do that?"
[00:07:54] Everett: Impressive and scary.
[00:07:55] Stacy: They were so little. And with my third one, he [00:08:00] was not even three weeks old, and we had a conference call. There was no Zoom at that point, thank God. But we had a conference call with the new CMO of Target.
[00:08:11] Everett: Okay.
[00:08:11] Stacy: And there was so much ruckus happening in my house, because other kids were home. I had to go take it in my car, but I was breastfeeding, and it was time for my guy to eat, so I was literally on this call in my car, [00:08:30] breastfeeding a three-week-old with the CMO of Target on the phone, thinking, "What am I doing? It's okay if this is what I want to be doing."
But is it what I want to be doing?
[00:08:43] Everett: Right.
[00:08:43] Stacy: And so once we started having those conversations — and the season that I was in with younger kids, and [00:08:50] my partner was in a little older season with her kids — I think I just needed something that was going to keep me home a little bit more.
[00:08:57] Everett: So you just alluded [00:09:00] to so many different business points, so let's drill down. We'll start from there, but we're going to do some other ones. So let's first just go with that — the connectivities between partners. First, having partners that do different things I think is really, really important, and we're trying to encourage small businesses to at least think about it, right?
It's okay if you're both creatives. But somebody does have to do the budget. Somebody does have to raise capital. Somebody does need to talk to the CMO of Target, right? And so as you look back in hindsight, [00:09:30] would you choose — not necessarily a different person, but would you choose a different aptitude or skillset?
[00:09:35] Stacy: It's a great question. I mean, the truth is I learned so much.
[00:09:39] Everett: Mm-hmm.
[00:09:39] Stacy: These weren't necessarily skills that I went in with.
[00:09:43] Everett: Yeah.
[00:09:44] Stacy: And the kind of managing the health of our partnerships and our clients was easy for me. The other stuff was a little bit uncomfortable.
[00:09:55] Everett: Yeah.
[00:09:56] Stacy: But I think that I learned to sit in the discomfort [00:10:00] a little bit more, which is something that I think is a huge lesson.
[00:10:04] Everett: I think all entrepreneurs have to do that.
[00:10:06] Stacy: As people we have to do that, right? But certainly in business. I do think that you have to go into a partnership with many things.
I mean, the first thing I did with my partner now, Merav — the first thing we talked about — was our divorce.
[00:10:20] Everett: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:10:21] Stacy: That was the first thing we actually set up. It was like, "Okay, great."
[00:10:25] Everett: What if it doesn't work?
[00:10:25] Stacy: What if it—
[00:10:25] Everett: —doesn't work? Yeah.
[00:10:27] Stacy: What if it doesn't work? Yeah. And that's not a conversation that I had had with that [00:10:30] partner.
[00:10:30] Everett: Gotcha.
[00:10:30] Stacy: And that made it really challenging when it wasn't working.
[00:10:34] Everett: Yeah.
[00:10:34] Stacy: So I think that piece of it — I do think understanding your roles, what you want to be, who you want to be, how you complement each other. Because, yes, you can have two creatives, but it also depends on the kind of creatives we're talking about. 'Cause if you have two real creatives, then you need a grown-up in the room — you need that person who can, like you said, look at a P&L, do those things. And so with that company I was able to [00:11:00] have support for that.
[00:11:01] Everett: Yeah.
[00:11:01] Stacy: But I do think at the end of the day, probably not focusing on our partnership at the beginning, we were so reactive — we could've done that better.
[00:11:11] Everett: Yeah.
[00:11:12] Stacy: But I took that learning, going into my partnership now, which is an incredible partnership — for the reasons that you just said, we do totally different things.
[00:11:21] Everett: Right.
[00:11:22] Stacy: And we have completely different skill sets.
[00:11:23] Everett: And that both — that is true.
[00:11:24] Neil: Yeah.
[00:11:25] Stacy: And different personalities. Everything about us is different.
[00:11:29] Everett: Yeah.
[00:11:29] Stacy: [00:11:30] And I actually think that is what makes it work so well.
[00:11:32] Everett: Okay. So second — which I'm not going to say is unique to women, 'cause I don't want a bunch of our male audience to email me and text me — but I will say that it's probably more prevalent in women, which is the decision to raise children. So not so much raising children, but how do you think about it now in terms of partnerships? 'Cause what you mentioned is really that you and your partner are at two different life cycles, or timing.
[00:11:55] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:11:55] Everett: You've got newborns.
[00:11:57] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:11:58] Everett: She's got older children. [00:12:00] Those are different things.
[00:12:02] Stacy: They're totally different things.
[00:12:03] Everett: Something's very different from bath time to going and watching a game on the weekend, so to speak, right? How do you think about that now? Or what education would you give to some of our female entrepreneurs — and the men?
[00:12:14] Stacy: I think these are just real things to be thought through. And if you have a partner in business, they're real things you have to be comfortable talking about. And, you know, people think you can't mix life and business, but when you're an [00:12:30] entrepreneur building a startup, as scrappy as we are, it's intertwined.
[00:12:34] Everett: Yeah. You have no choice.
[00:12:35] Stacy: You have no choice.
[00:12:36] Everett: Yeah, I think the funniest thing sometimes I hear people say is, "I want to be an entrepreneur so I have more free time," and I'm like, "Oh my gosh, who told you that lie?" Because so many people keep saying that lie, and I'm like, is this TikTok? Is this Instagram? Where does that come from? It's the exact opposite.
[00:12:50] Stacy: Yeah, and we're in a different era. Nothing turns off ever. It's funny, I was just listening this morning to a podcast, and I was trying to decide if I [00:13:00] liked her or not. There are some women probably, you know, 15 years younger than me,
[00:13:06] Neil: Yeah.
[00:13:06] Stacy: and one of them was saying how every parenting book right now — and I get it — is like, we have to demonstrate who we want our kids to be, and what we show them is who they will be. And phone is a huge part of that in my household.
[00:13:21] Neil: Interesting. Yeah.
[00:13:21] Stacy: And it is something that I struggle with, because what she was saying was, on the weekends, my phone goes away. When I'm at home, I don't want my [00:13:30] kids to see me on my phone, and that is complicated, because on one hand, our phones and our computers have actually given us more freedom to be at home.
[00:13:40] Everett: Yes.
[00:13:40] Stacy: Right? So like my husband, same thing — he can be at home, but we still have to work at home.
[00:13:46] Everett: That's right.
[00:13:46] Stacy: We don't have another office we can go sit in in our home, and so a lot of it is done out in the open.
[00:13:51] Everett: Yeah.
[00:13:52] Stacy: At the moment, I'm watching our social media, and then there's all the talk about emerging brands — founder-led, being there, [00:14:00] constantly showing up.
[00:14:01] Everett: Yeah.
[00:14:01] Stacy: So here's my daughter—
[00:14:02] Everett: And they want to kind of see you in your element.
[00:14:05] Stacy: But I'm trying to tell my kids, tech's not good for your brain. You're not getting the dopamine you need. My daughter — "Don't be on TikTok." And then they're over here seeing me on my device.
[00:14:15] Everett: Yeah, yeah. They're like, "You just—"
[00:14:18] Stacy: Yeah, what are you doing?
[00:14:19] Everett: Right.
[00:14:19] Stacy: And it's a conversation, and we talk about it. Ten years ago it wouldn't have been that way, even for my husband, certainly pre-COVID. But now I'm accessible all the time. It's just what it is right now.
[00:14:35] Everett: Yes, it is. Interesting dynamics, just whenever we think about partners and how to deal with partners. Let's keep moving in terms of your career. So you go from creative and marketing [00:14:47] into consumer product goods,
[00:14:49] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:14:49] Everett: CPG. So what drew you into products? I guess you were already technically dealing with consumers, but maybe dealing with them in a different way for experience, and then into—
[00:14:59] Stacy: Yeah. [00:15:00] Well, after I left Crafting Community, I took a minute and did the consulting thing. And I immediately kind of — I was helping other female entrepreneurs
[00:15:10] Everett: Mm.
[00:15:10] Stacy: — just as a utility consultant. What are you doing? And I hooked up with one incredible company who was building her brand, and actually — again, this would be really helpful for my next job — she had a gifting company with these beautiful bespoke boxes, and I helped build her team. I did a little bit of everything.
[00:15:29] Everett: Okay.
[00:15:29] Stacy: [00:15:30] And then COVID hit, and a lot of people didn't need consultants during COVID. And Merav, my co-founder, and I — we were homeschooling five kids between the two of us. Little kids. And going back to that product piece — like I said, I've always loved storytelling.
[00:15:46] Neil: Mm-hmm.
[00:15:46] Stacy: And I think I've always wanted a tangible product. My brother and I are those siblings who are best friends constantly like, "What about this idea? What about that idea?" Always in my head, and nothing has ever [00:16:00] felt like the right thing I could make money at. And Merav was, I think, someone I could talk about just ideas with.
And so it was actually her who called me and said, after bemoaning about a very specific issue, which was dealing with sensitive skin in our house — her kids have eczema, my kids were dealing with mosquito bites, and [00:16:20] it was what we were putting on them that was awful — chemicals — and we would complain about it all the time to each other.
[00:16:27] Everett: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
[00:16:28] Stacy: And just one night she called [00:16:30] me in the middle of COVID, at the height of it all, and she said, "Okay, I have an idea. What about—" A pimple patch, right? They're all the rage. Infused with botanicals, to put onto a mosquito bite to help it heal.
[00:16:42] Everett: Interesting.
[00:16:43] Stacy: And it clicked, and I was like, "That is so smart and genius. Why has no one done this?"
[00:16:49] Everett: Yeah.
[00:16:49] Stacy: "You should totally do it." And she was like, "No, no, no, no, we're doing this together." So I knew I had always wanted a thing, but I also knew from watching [00:17:00] plenty of Shark Tank that I didn't want a product. So I did a little bit of digging into where this solution would fall, and where I landed was that this falls at this intersection of personal care and first aid.
And I think when we hear "first aid," a lot of people automatically go to the big — you know, they think of the Red Cross, they think big emergency, when the truth is every day we have little emergencies that [00:17:30] require first aid. Whether it's
[00:17:31] Everett: Yeah.
[00:17:31] Stacy: you're in the kitchen and you burn yourself, whether you scrape yourself getting into your car — all of these—
[00:17:37] Everett: I had one yesterday, literally. I got nicked by a piece of paper and I was like, "Oh my God."
[00:17:41] Stacy: "Oh my God." I hope you had our bandage on you. And so when I was looking at this, and looking at all of the other categories — stay with me here — we've cleaned up our pantries, [00:18:00] right? We've cleaned up our medicine cabinets to an extent. We've cleaned up our beauty regimens. There's all these categories in our homes that we've really thought about and made better choices on.
And so when I circled back to this one thing in first aid — why is no one cleaning that aisle up?
[00:18:11] Everett: Yeah.
[00:18:11] Stacy: And we're still putting garbage on our skin. So once I identified the market and the opportunity, and where it's going, [00:18:20] I went back to Merav and I was like, "Okay, I get it now.
[00:18:23] Everett: Yeah."
[00:18:23] Stacy: "I've identified the white space. We can do it." And that's what made it interesting.
[00:18:29] Everett: So how did you come [00:18:30] up with the name? Or were you all coming up with the name — All Better Co.? Very cool name, by the way — I think of the five-year-old, "I'm gonna make it all better." That was it, right?
[00:18:38] Stacy: Literally, that was it. And I think you probably talk to so many entrepreneurs who constantly are going through names and names — and you go through the exercise, and you see if they're available, and you're just so tired, so tired.
[00:18:49] Everett: Yes, we did that too.
[00:18:50] Stacy: And then all of a sudden, one day, you start saying words, you put it together,
[00:18:56] Everett: Yeah.
[00:18:56] Stacy: and we were like, "Duh — wait, [00:19:00] no. All Better. We're moms. This is what we're doing."
We're, this is — we're the world's first responder in most situations.
[00:19:07] Everett: Absolutely.
[00:19:08] Stacy: And we're there to make things better, in all the ways.
[00:19:10] Everett: Yes.
[00:19:11] Stacy: And then we looked it up, and the name was available.
[00:19:14] Everett: Yeah.
[00:19:14] Stacy: We could trademark it. We could own it.
[00:19:16] Everett: Yeah.
[00:19:16] Stacy: I don't know, it just felt like the universe — it just was. And now, so often we could be talking to someone at these huge venture capital firms, and one of the first things they ask us is, "How'd you get your name?
[00:19:28] Everett: Right?"
[00:19:29] Stacy: "How is it even [00:19:30] available?"
[00:19:30] Everett: Right. It seems it shouldn't have been available. It just shouldn't have been.
[00:19:35] Stacy: But also, it's like, perfect.
[00:19:36] Everett: Yeah.
[00:19:37] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:19:37] Everett: So when you think about competing in a category with a brand — you do know brands, 'cause obviously you've worked with Target and you've worked with Nike and others — but how do you think about that when you think about All Better Co. and competing with, I don't know, Johnson & Johnson? I don't know who the big ones are that you think about, but—
[00:19:52] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:19:52] Everett: —you know.
[00:19:55] Stacy: Well, right now I don't really think of myself as [00:20:00] competing with them. There's nothing that I can do on that level, right? So I'm really having to gain some kind of brand equity. So that's really how I approach it right now.
[00:20:16] Everett: Interesting.
[00:20:17] Stacy: I try and have the blinders on. By the way, we are really thoughtfully and mindfully trying to build this brand and grow toward acquisition. Because I think once a bigger company has a hold of what we're doing — [00:20:30] man, we could do so much good for so many more people.
[00:20:32] Everett: Absolutely.
[00:20:33] Stacy: But right now, I think we're just really focused on our own brand equity and making sure that we are gaining the trust of our consumer. Because we're small, we have the ability to be flexible, to pivot, to turn, to talk directly to our consumer. That's just how we approach it right now. I can't compete with them.
[00:20:54] Everett: Yeah.
[00:20:55] Stacy: So, but I can carve out where we belong, and just do things differently. [00:21:00]
[00:21:00] Everett: But your customer is the same. Who do you define as your customer?
[00:21:03] Stacy: Anyone with skin.
[00:21:04] Everett: Okay, that's a lot of people.
[00:21:06] Stacy: It's a lot of people.
[00:21:07] Everett: Right.
[00:21:07] Stacy: But we're definitely talking to mom right now. I think I've done enough work and understanding, especially since around 2009, 2010 — studies are really showing us that women drive the economy.
[00:21:23] Everett: Sure.
[00:21:23] Stacy: And moms are the CFO, CMO, COO of their households, and [00:21:30] they're making the majority of the purchasing decisions of what comes in. Not to mention now, for my generation, we're part of the sandwich generation — caring for my young kids, but now also helping with some of the decision-making for my aging parents.
[00:21:45] Everett: Sure.
[00:21:46] Stacy: So we're sitting in these two different — moms have the opportunity to actually speak to two different generations and make choices for them. And mom's kind of the original — she's the OG influencer. [00:22:00] She finds something she loves, and she's in the group chat: "You guys—"
[00:22:06] Everett: "You guys gotta listen to this."
[00:22:06] Stacy: Yes.
[00:22:07] Everett: "This."
[00:22:07] Stacy: I—
[00:22:07] Everett: I totally agree.
[00:22:08] Stacy: "I just found this out, can you even imagine?" Or, you know, we ask each other — when you have kids, the people I trusted the most were my other mom friends
[00:22:17] Everett: Yeah, for sure.
[00:22:17] Stacy: and my pediatrician.
[00:22:18] Everett: Yeah.
[00:22:18] Stacy: That was it. So I think that as a trusted source, we're really talking to her, or heads of households, in that way, and that kind of creates this halo effect.
[00:22:28] Everett: You talk about this [00:22:30] company, and you talk about the desire to build it towards acquisition.
[00:22:33] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:22:33] Everett: I've heard you mention the number 400. Is that a BHAG? Where did that come from? Do you have to have a goal? Is this the Stacy the athlete that has to have a championship?
[00:22:45] Stacy: I think it's that, whether it's — listen, if you talk to investors, it shouldn't be 400 million, it would be higher than that. Add a zero to it. I think I say it in the sense of, no, we are building a generational, [00:23:00]
[00:23:00] Everett: Mm-hmm.
[00:23:02] Stacy: life-defining-moment type of brand. Ultimately, I'm building it for acquisition to change my family's life,
[00:23:11] Everett: True.
[00:23:11] Stacy: for sure.
[00:23:13] Everett: Yeah.
[00:23:13] Stacy: But also, I do think, toward acquisition, one of our significant goals is access to better products. We want to democratize that, right?
[00:23:23] Everett: No, I totally get it.
[00:23:23] Stacy: It shouldn't just be for the people who can go into Whole Foods and afford to get the [00:23:30] better things to put in their body and on their body.
[00:23:32] Neil: Mm-hmm.
[00:23:32] Stacy: And I ultimately believe that a bigger company, with all of the resources they have in place, will enable our products to get into more hands, and we need to stay true to what makes us better. That's really the goal. I do think I keep that number because I need to work towards something, and I need to remember that's what I'm working toward. Again, not for the compensation piece [00:24:00] of it, but to build mindfully toward that every day.
[00:24:03] Everett: That's great, that's great. All right, we're going to take a quick break.
[00:24:06] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:24:06] Everett: We're going to talk to Lendistry's customer.
[00:24:13] Neil: My name is Neil Kumar. The company's name is Summit Juice Co. I'm originally from the UK, and I'm Los Angeles based. The problems I was experiencing when founding the business were that I envisioned a few ideas, and I couldn't put them into practice because I didn't have the funds. My result working with Lendistry was that it was just such a great experience.
Having a partner like Lendistry that brings us in on events, lets us have more access to capital, and lets us grow as a business, and lets us put our dreams into reality — we brought more team members on board. We were able to invest in a van. We were able to go to more locations and invest in better equipment and materials.
I always work with Lendistry, and if there's anyone asking for capital, ideas, or advice, I always send them Lendistry's way. [00:25:00]
[00:25:05] Everett: Welcome back, Stacy. You've said so many great things that I want to kind of double-click on with our entrepreneurs, and make sure that they understand and that I understand. Let's do a little bit of round robin here — bear with me as I ask you different types of questions. So the first one is, you're in a new partnership. You talked a lot about the old partnership you were in. How do you and Merav kind of split the duties now? I know you've learned a lot from the other [00:25:30] partnership.
[00:25:31] Stacy: Yeah, I mean, again, I think this is where partnership is really important, and they're hard.
[00:25:37] Everett: Yeah.
[00:25:37] Stacy: All partnerships in life are hard, right? Friendships, relationships, and this one is no different.
[00:25:44] Everett: Yeah.
[00:25:44] Stacy: And it just — we found that it works because, like I was saying, we're so different, and our skillsets are so different.
[00:25:52] Everett: Yeah.
[00:25:52] Stacy: Merav wants to tinker and invent and do spreadsheets, and is much more operationally [00:26:00] behind the scenes. And I love the sexy stuff — the brand storytelling stuff, the partnerships, the community building, all of those things. As a founder you're not able to do all of them yet, but we kind of sit in these two different silos: operations, and marketing and brand building.
And there's no disputing that. Now, that said, we [00:26:30] both know what's happening in each other's silos, and we both get to make big decisions.
If we disagree on something — for example, if I disagree on something that's in Merav's silo, and I say my piece, and if it's something that she's willing to stand firm on, then I acquiesce. I'm like, "Okay, you got it." Compromise. That's your silo, and we have to be willing to sit in that. And she knows for me, when we're sending out decks and I don't really like the picture selection or what it is — because I believe our visual, our point of view, is so important to our brand story,
[00:27:07] Neil: Right.
[00:27:07] Stacy: she's like, "This is your thing. If this is important, then you go with that." So I think that's kind of how it's been parceled out. As we get bigger, turns out you need more people in a silo.
[00:27:20] Everett: Yeah, that's right.
[00:27:21] Stacy: So that's really worked for us really well. And honestly, it's just kind of been natural.
[00:27:27] Everett: That's great.
[00:27:29] Everett: You mentioned this — well, maybe I mentioned it. I said, hey, you pivoted industries, but your role was very similar across all of them. I guess two parts: one, did you pivot? And then separately, do you have any recommendations for entrepreneurs who make a pivot when they go across disciplines — I would consider sports versus consumer products different disciplines, or different industries, so to speak — but
[00:27:57] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:27:58] Everett: do you have any recommendations?
[00:27:59] Stacy: I mean, well, listen, so it's interesting — my major in college, no one ever believes me — my major in college was sociology of sport.
[00:28:10] Everett: Okay.
[00:28:10] Stacy: So you're talking about people and their stories, and sports, and what that did for them, how that defined them or whatnot. So I've always been drawn to stories.
[00:28:23] Everett: Mm-hmm.
[00:28:23] Stacy: And marketing your brand, for me, is just telling a story, and I'm [00:28:30] completely passionate about that. So the pivoting part — yes, I think having to market and brand a consumer product is very different.
[00:28:41] Everett: Yeah.
[00:28:41] Stacy: Especially when you have a machine running one of them, and you're — you're having to learn totally new rules. But as far as my skillset, that hasn't pivoted. I'm just — because I'm so passionate about telling the story of our brand. And so for entrepreneurs who want to pivot, [00:29:00] I'm all for it. I just think you have to pivot for the right reasons. Again, like I said earlier, I want to make money.
[00:29:07] Everett: Yeah.
[00:29:08] Stacy: And I will make money.
[00:29:09] Everett: Yeah.
[00:29:10] Stacy: I will make a lot of money.
[00:29:12] Everett: Understood.
[00:29:13] Stacy: So that's something I would say. I think people think they're pivoting into something different,
[00:29:20] Everett: Yeah.
[00:29:20] Stacy: but you're not — you're taking a skillset and applying it differently.
[00:29:23] Everett: And—
[00:29:24] Stacy: it might—
[00:29:25] Everett: Agree.
[00:29:25] Stacy: Yeah, right? So the application of what that is looks different. Honestly, aside from going into surgery or something, [00:29:30] there's not much I would be scared to do or try, if it were in my sphere of being able to tell stories, to connect, to create partnerships. I could do that.
[00:29:45] Everett: That makes sense. When you think about building a brand from scratch — tell me mistakes, or maybe wins, that you'd tell another entrepreneur to focus on.
[00:30:01] Stacy: Yeah, I think it's actually a great question, because I am, by nature, one of those people who struggles with celebrating wins.
[00:30:07] Everett: Me too.
[00:30:07] Stacy: You know — you listen to coaches in sports, when they've won their division,
[00:30:20] Everett: Right, the nationals or whatever.
[00:30:28] Stacy: Right — they're like, "We'll celebrate this today, and then tomorrow we're back to work." I really think — and I say this for myself — [00:30:34] it is so important to try and sit back every now and again and look at what you have done, because, as a society, it's so easy to sit in that place of feeling like you're lacking something, or you don't have this, or you haven't done that. And I don't think that's going to get us anywhere. And so I constantly am reminding myself [00:31:00] to take a step back and say, "Okay, today was hard, but also look at what we have built."
[00:31:06] Everett: That's right.
[00:31:07] Stacy: We built a physical thing, a product. And I was at a luncheon the other day with some incredible women.
[00:31:19] Everett: Yeah, I gotcha.
[00:31:19] Stacy: Some incredible women, I can't even believe it — and we all stood up and briefly said who we were. And I stood up and I talked about my company, [00:31:30] and one woman from across the room goes, "Oh my God, I'm wearing your bandage right now."
[00:31:33] Everett: Oh, that was—
[00:31:33] Stacy: And another woman was like, "I know your company."
[00:31:38] Everett: Yeah.
[00:31:38] Stacy: And those moments are sometimes even hard for me to take in.
[00:31:44] Everett: Totally get it.
[00:31:44] Stacy: But afterward, I had to tell someone so that I honored the moment.
[00:31:49] Everett: Sure.
[00:31:50] Stacy: And I think that's a really hard thing to do when you're in it, and so I say it for myself, and I would tell any other entrepreneur — [00:31:57]
[00:31:57] Stacy: celebrate the wins, [00:32:00] and do it every day.
[00:32:00] Everett: I think it's also hard, too, as an entrepreneur, 'cause most of us are always capital raising. So you've got somebody every day telling you your baby's ugly, and then you see somebody say, "Oh, I love your baby," and you're like, "Who are you? I'm used to this other thing." So I totally get it. If you could go and talk to founders and say, "Hey, this is one of the things you should consider [00:32:22] in building a product," or maybe even talk to young Stacy, what would you tell her, or what would you tell them, as some advice?
[00:32:29] Stacy: Yeah, I mean, [00:32:30] there's a lot, obviously, as you can imagine. Things that have worked really well for us — one is asking a lot of questions. We just talked with people for the first nine months, understanding products, talking to formulators, talking to manufacturers.
[00:32:49] Everett: Yes.
[00:32:49] Stacy: We asked a lot of questions, and we still ask a lot of questions. We are not afraid to say we don't know.
[00:32:57] Everett: Yeah.
[00:32:57] Stacy: We're onboarding with a national retailer right now, and we don't have an ops person right now to do the onboarding, [00:33:00] and so we're having to learn it.
[00:33:06] Everett: Yeah.
[00:33:07] Stacy: And it doesn't feel great to go back to those folks who want us to come into 120 stores and say, "Hey, what do you mean when you say this part?" But I think you kind of have to put ego aside in that way, and ask a lot of questions. I think you have to build a community also of other entrepreneurs or advisors that you can speak to and who are willing to give you their time. [00:33:30] So I think that's the number one — ask questions, and build community around you that you trust and that you can ask.
And then, the thing for me that I would tell myself — I'm kind of risk-averse. I'm safety Stacy. And I think that risk-taking is inherently part of what we're doing. And I wish that there were a couple of risks that we had taken earlier.
[00:33:59] Everett: Mm-hmm.
[00:33:59] Stacy: And [00:34:00] we didn't.
[00:34:01] Everett: Yeah.
[00:34:01] Stacy: But now I think it's making me look at new opportunities presented to us that I would've said no to, or that we shouldn't do — where now I'm like, "No, we just gotta do it."
[00:34:09] Everett: Yeah. Well, you know what I find is that when you attach yourself to an anchor institution — like what you're going through now, which is what you did with Zappos and with Target — there's a buildup to it. And so what I find sometimes, as entrepreneurs, when we're risk-averse, is that we're not understanding that natural cycle a business needs to [00:34:30] go through, right? Maybe 20 stores before 120, right? There's some version of that, and we all know the reasons why — capital, people, there's a bunch of reasons — but there is this cycle that a business goes through, just like a person, right? I tell entrepreneurs, you wouldn't wear the same clothes at 10 that you wore at 5.
[00:34:52] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:34:53] Everett: You wouldn't wear the same clothes at 20 that you wore at 10. And a business has its own kind of evolution it goes through too,
[00:34:57] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:34:58] Everett: whether it be people, capital, [00:35:00] or partners.
[00:35:01] Stacy: Yeah.
[00:35:02] Everett: Okay, we're going to end on two fun ones. [00:35:03]
[00:35:03] Stacy: Okay.
[00:35:04] Everett: Favorite soccer player right now. Hopefully I don't get you in trouble.
[00:35:09] Stacy: Oh my gosh. Favorite soccer player — there are so—
[00:35:13] Everett: I know.
[00:35:13] Stacy: I know, there's so many. So I'm just going to say the first one that pops into my head, which is Rose Lavelle. She plays on the national team and is a professional soccer player.
[00:35:22] Everett: Yeah.
[00:35:23] Stacy: And she is just so smooth, and she's a risk-taker — she will throw moves and get [00:35:30] in and out.
[00:35:30] Everett: Yeah.
[00:35:31] Stacy: But God, there's so many — the Thompson sisters. I'm so excited. Honestly, I am so excited for where women's soccer is right now. It's massive. And this young group of women — I mean, Sophia Wilson — I don't know, all of them. They're just — talk about motherhood and grit, and I think what female athletes are now doing, not only to grow their sport, but the economy, [00:36:00]
[00:36:00] Everett: Yep.
[00:36:00] Stacy: for gender equality —
[00:36:04] Everett: Yeah.
[00:36:04] Stacy: I'm trying to get them all in as investors to be part of our — you know? So I know I went off there, but I—
[00:36:10] Everett: No, that's okay. I love it. Awesome. Well, Stacy, it's been such a pleasure
[00:36:13] Stacy: This is so great. I love it—
[00:36:14] Everett: having you on the show, and thanks for your time.
[00:36:16] Stacy: Yeah, thank you.
[00:36:17] Everett: Thanks for hanging out with us on Small Business Unscripted. Want more? Head to smallbusinessunscripted.com for helpful resources, more episodes, and to keep the conversation [00:36:30] going.