Magic Johnson Enterprises' Andre Johnson on getting teams aligned around a vision they can't see yet—and why collaboration beats fear every single time.
Andre Johnson has worked everywhere—music A&R, gaming (he got Steven Spielberg's approval for a Jurassic Park VR game), hospitality, and now as EVP at Magic Johnson Enterprises. What connects it all? Vision. And the ability to get people rowing in the same direction without using fear.
Andre breaks down how MJE evaluates partners (it starts with how they treat their people), where the next sports investment opportunities are hiding, and why the gaming industry's customer feedback loop should be required learning for every entrepreneur.
What you'll learn:
Andre:
"If I can get the people involved to buy into the importance of their role and take us from here to there, and really understand it—if I can help you only be successful at what you do and not ask you to step into somebody else's shoes—then I find that the process is easier."
"Fear-based culture doesn't work. I don't care how much success somebody has had. The team behind them will tell you it's not that way."
"Gaming's not gonna slow down. You think about all the studios and people who have IP, they're now trying to get the gaming audience. The more that we can help young people see a pathway along those things, then we will start to see some of the great inventors of tomorrow."
Links & Resources:
Timestamps:
00:30 – Introduction to Andre Johnson and Magic Johnson Enterprises
02:00 – Andre's Journey from Music to Business Development
03:30 – Transitioning from Music to Gaming
07:00 – Asset Management and Hospitality Ventures
08:05 – Working at Magic Johnson Enterprises
09:55 – Leadership and Vision in Business
13:00 – Community Empowerment and Partnerships
16:05 – Navigating Partnerships and Investments
18:55 – WNBA's Growth and Excitement
22:10 – Opportunities in STEM and Gaming
25:25 – Location Matters in Investments
27:15 – Leading Through Change
31:00 – The Importance of Customer Feedback
32:55 – Paying Attention to the Details
0:00:00.2 Everett Sands: Tell me where you think there's some opportunities if you were thinking about different kinds of sports.
0:00:04.5 Andre Johnson: I think if it was me, I would definitely look at the growth of volleyball because there's still more women's volleyball scholarships given out on an annual basis than any other sport. Gaming's not going to slow down. You think about all the studios and people who have IP, they're now trying to get the gaming audience. Steven Spielberg was actually one of our investors at the time, but Jurassic is his baby.
0:00:28.0 Everett Sands: Yeah, that's right.
0:00:28.4 Andre Johnson: So we had to give him the final approval for our game before we had put it out.
0:00:33.0 Everett Sands: That's Andre Johnson, Executive Vice President over at Magic Johnson Enterprises. Magic Johnson Enterprises has been helping communities through economic empowerment ever since it was founded in 1987 by Magic Johnson. What's special about Andre is he has such a diverse background, and he's going to share with us how they make decisions on partnerships and investing in various communities. Welcome to Small Business Unscripted. How are you doing, Andre?
0:01:02.5 Andre Johnson: I'm fantastic, brother. Thank you for having me.
0:01:04.4 Everett Sands: That's good. That's good. Happy you're here. So I always start with this first question to everyone that comes in. And there's no wrong answer. Today, as you think about it, put these three in order. Quality of life, career, or compensation? Just stack rank those today for me.
0:01:21.8 Andre Johnson: Number one at this point in life is definitely quality of life. Then probably compensation.
0:01:29.5 Everett Sands: How do you define quality of life?
0:01:32.1 Andre Johnson: Quality of life to me is work-life balance. Being able to spend time with family, be there for your kids, do sporting events, but still do what you have to do work-wise. Definitely travel, being able to attend certain things, and not just focus on the grind of it all. Today's society is easy. Grind, grind, grind. It's like, no, you actually have to slow down and enjoy life too.
0:01:57.4 Everett Sands: I totally agree. Especially once you get to a certain age where unfortunately you have partners that get sick or friends that pass away and different things like that. It starts to put some things in perspective.
0:02:07.3 Andre Johnson: Absolutely.
0:02:08.2 Everett Sands: So you started your professional career in music.
0:02:11.8 Andre Johnson: Yes.
0:02:12.9 Everett Sands: Tell us about that first. What was the goal?
0:02:14.2 Andre Johnson: It's interesting. When I was in high school, I wanted to be an artist. So moving to LA from Michigan, it's like bright lights and my family wouldn't quite let me be a rapper, which I wanted to be. So ultimately, I had an opportunity to work in the music industry. Jay Brown was a friend of ours. He gave me my first shot. I was working in the A&R department and going to school at the same time. So it was a cool way to kind of stay close to the music and be involved. I just wasn't rapping anymore.
0:02:45.2 Everett Sands: I got you. And you went from that into business development. So I guess somewhat AR is business development, depending on what the job was.
0:02:55.3 Andre Johnson: Yeah, when you think about it, A&R could be artists and repertoire, but it's basically the same thing as BD. In essence, it's all problem solving. Working with all the departments, work with the artists, get budget, get marketing involved, publishing, the video shoots, publicity. So, business development is pretty much the same thing. It's identifying who makes sense from a partnership standpoint. What are the issues? How do you move forward? What's the opportunity? So a lot of the same things apply.
0:03:25.6 Everett Sands: Now, business development, you spent some time in the gaming industry. Tell me music versus gaming. Any connection there or how did they compare or contrast?
0:03:35.8 Andre Johnson: I think a lot of the connections are probably the same because there's always a base for music within games. And so now whether you're playing a sports game, there's always a soundtrack, right? Whether it's 2K Madden, FC 26, there's always a musical component to that. And even first player, not just shooters, but RPG games, all those games have some sort of musical element to them. And now I've found a lot of the top producers that I worked with from the music industry before are now figuring out how to apply music to soundtracks or score a video game or score a movie or a TV show.
0:04:18.7 Everett Sands: That makes sense.
0:04:19.5 Andre Johnson: So it's an easy transition.
0:04:21.6 Everett Sands: What does BD look like in the gaming industry? Are you trying to get partners? You mentioned the music, so I kind of get that part of it, but what does that look like?
0:04:30.4 Andre Johnson: Yeah, there's everything from investors, there's different development companies, or let's say, we'll just use when I was working in VR as the opportunity. We wanted to build a VR game or an experience. And so as the BD person, you look at the landscape and say, okay, at the time, the home market was moving a little slow. So the big sort of dreamscape type of opportunities, the family entertainment centers, were sort of the future for where the industry was headed in terms of at an early stage. So I looked across the board, what was the IP that was coming out? It was Jurassic. And then actually I did a study that said, what are the most famous logos in the world? And that Jurassic dinosaur was number one. The Bat-Signal was number two at the time. This was 2016. And so the new Jurassic Fallen Kingdom movie was coming out that summer.So I said, let's go talk to Universal and see if we can make a ride as a Jurassic IP. And it just so happens that the filmmakers were down for it. And that was a surreal but frightening experience because Steven Spielberg was actually one of our investors at the time, but Jurassic is his baby.
0:05:51.9 Everett Sands: Yeah, that's right.
0:05:52.0 Andre Johnson: So we had to give him the final approval for our game before we put it out.
0:05:56.8 Everett Sands: That's cool.
0:05:57.5 Andre Johnson: So it was a really dope experience. And he gave us a standing ovation and we launched in 120 Dave & Buster's because that was what we identified as the best sort of family entertainment center at the time.
0:06:10.3 Everett Sands: Yeah, interesting.
0:06:10.7 Andre Johnson: And we were super successful in doing that.
0:06:12.6 Everett Sands: That's interesting. I mean, there's so many different things in there. There's obviously what I'll call the lead or anchor investor that needs to sign off. There's the partnership with Dave & Buster, which is really a distribution partnership at the end of the day. And then you also mentioned kind of virtual, which takes me two ways. I think about virtual, I think about AI. Your connectivity to Jurassic Park and recognizing it's a brand, EA and other businesses that have recognized that we could take that launch pad of whether it be a movie, whether it be a ride, and then transition it into a video game, I think is really important. We actually talked to businesses about anchor institutions and anchor moments. And that's the way I think about this. Like what anchor institution, what anchor moment can you attach yourself to? And I think EA has done a really good job of that. Now, they're now the anchor institution. So it's a whole different thing now.
0:07:02.8 Andre Johnson: It was a journey. You'll see in the documentary, it was definitely a journey to get there.
0:07:06.7 Everett Sands: That is so cool. You also got involved in asset management. So I heard you mention, obviously, investors. What attracted you to that business or that side of the business?
0:07:15.6 Andre Johnson: You know, it's interesting. Asset management is really a different version of business development. And I've always been somebody who's a foodie and love to travel. So I was working in asset management in the hospitality department. And so we bought and repositioned and redeveloped a lot of different hotels. And so it was a great, fun experience. And I had an opportunity to build a restaurant from the ground up, which I had never done. And you roll up your sleeves and you see what all goes into it and the budget and hire the chef and design the restaurant. So it was definitely a really good experience. But I think the collaboration and the hospitality component of it kind of attracted me to it.
0:07:58.9 Everett Sands: Gotcha. So let's make sure the audience knows kind of where you're at. So we'll fast forward a little bit. So you're part of Magic Johnson Enterprises.
0:08:07.7 Andre Johnson: Yes.
0:08:09.0 Everett Sands: And what I have here is MJE aims to stimulate economic growth and job opportunities, urban multicultural communities through strategic investments and partnerships.
0:08:17.6 Andre Johnson: That's correct.
0:08:18.5 Everett Sands: So let's go back a little bit. What's it like working for your dad? Or what's it like working in a family business, knowing that you've been on the outside and kind of non-family businesses?
0:08:28.2 Andre Johnson: Going back into the family establishment after being outside has its own set of challenges. When you're working for the guy who is driving the ship and is used to operating at a certain pace, from being on the outside, from gaming and hospitality, there's a certain amount of patience that's been learned in the process that he doesn't necessarily have at the top level. It can be challenging from that perspective.
0:09:00.0 Everett Sands: But to what you said earlier, it has given you obviously an opportunity to look at a bunch of different industries.
0:09:05.9 Andre Johnson: Yes.
0:09:06.4 Everett Sands: What's your favorite or discipline, maybe? Like, so will it be financial services, will it be sports teams? Like, what's your favorite?
0:09:13.5 Andre Johnson: You know, it's interesting. I don't know what... I love sports. So kind of going back to that, that's probably always at the top level. But for me, it's more the process and the interconnectivity of it all. I've always been someone who God blessed me with vision, being a visionary, so to speak. So when I can see the pieces and how they can come together to make a bigger whole, that gets me excited. I've always been fascinated about the process and how things are put together. And how did you come to that result? What are the things that you did to get from A to Z?
0:09:55.9 Everett Sands: So I find as a visionary myself, that's the hardest part, though. Because you see something and you have to get to it. And let's be honest, everybody doesn't roll in the same direction.
0:10:06.9 Andre Johnson: That is 100% correct.
0:10:08.6 Everett Sands: Or you got to get them to roll in the same direction.
0:10:10.4 Andre Johnson: That part.
0:10:10.9 Everett Sands: And they might not have seen it already, right? So I have people, I'm just speaking for myself, so you don't have to agree. But like I have people that are literally like they call it doubting Thomas. They haven't seen it. And because they can't see it and haven't seen it, there's skepticism. Is it like that for you?
0:10:29.2 Andre Johnson: 100%. And it's that way in all industries that I've worked in, right? Like there's certain people who don't have that vision that we have. And so sometimes even when you articulate it, they might not necessarily believe in it. So then that creates doubt.
0:10:48.1 Everett Sands: So how do you manage that?
0:10:49.7 Andre Johnson: The way I found success within that is if I can get the people involved to buy into the importance of their role and taking us from here to there and really understanding it. If I can help you only be successful at what you do and not ask you to step into somebody else's shoes, then I find that the process is easier. And then people can see that their role in specificity like adds to the greater good.
0:11:19.0 Everett Sands: Gotcha.
0:11:19.4 Andre Johnson: Because I feel like sometimes you as the finance person might not feel that the financial model is as important as the art department putting together the thought to investors.
0:11:31.1 Everett Sands: Totally get it.
0:11:31.2 Andre Johnson: But it all has to come together. If it doesn't look good, if the numbers aren't correct, then we don't get to the investment. So I found that if I can empower the people around me to really understand and take those steps and hey, if someone is just an admin, why don't you participate in this call? I know you have some interest in such and such industry or you might have contact. Come take the call with me. You lead.
0:11:55.7 Everett Sands: And do you get, I'm thinking about... I think it's Nick Saban, back in the day, I know they still have it because he's obviously not there anymore. He used to have this banner that says everybody do their job. Is the way you handle that related to sports? I mean, is it kind of that camaraderie that you're trying to build, which generally we hear sports teams have? The good ones.
0:12:13.2 Andre Johnson: I think so. I think you learn it from playing. I played basketball and football in high school. So it's like you learn the collaboration, especially football. You play football too. So if you're in alignment and you're really building a rapport with the offensive linemen and you're running back or quarterback, it's going to make a difference how they block for you.
0:12:34.0 Everett Sands: Absolutely.
0:12:34.1 Andre Johnson: And how you're spending time, how are you sowing seeds into them? How are you helping them to be the best version of what they do? And I find that leaders who do that, they get the better results.
0:12:45.2 Everett Sands: That's awesome.
0:12:46.1 Andre Johnson: Because fear-based culture doesn't work. I don't care how much success somebody has had, the team behind them will tell you it's not that way. Monetary, yeah, but it's about building the next generation of leaders and sort of empowering people.
0:13:04.0 Everett Sands: When I think about MJE, I mean, you guys have a ton of partnerships, but you also have a mission. How do you think about partnerships and mission? When you go in it, because you've got skills in business development, you obviously know the product pretty well. How do you think about the partners that you guys bring on?
0:13:22.8 Andre Johnson: It's interesting. A lot of it sort of starts with community. What are you doing to empower the communities in which you are? What are you doing to help those who might not have the same opportunity? And as leaders, how are you dealing with the people that work for you? That's a big thing for me. I try to go in and listen more than I talk, just so I can kind of see how are you talking to the people that work for you? How are you interacting with the people that are, in essence, subordinate to you? Are you speaking over them in a meeting? Are you letting them participate? So I just try to look for moral and sort of ethical alignment first, and then there's a lot of great ideas and great ways to partner and make money, but it kind of starts with who are you as a person? How are you leading?
0:14:12.4 Everett Sands: Interesting.
0:14:13.0 Andre Johnson: And what are you doing to empower people?
0:14:16.5 Everett Sands: How do you think about those partnerships and trying to have growth inside of the community?
0:14:21.9 Andre Johnson: Part of it is, okay, what is the existing platform and what's the existing goal? Are you trying to build learning centers or STEM centers in the community? Okay, let's go into the community, South Central LA or Inglewood or wherever you are, and what is it that they need? The people will tell you what they need and sort of what they want from that perspective. So I learned that from asset management. You have to talk to the community first. You can't just come and put a business in that you think will thrive. You have to figure out from the people, they'll tell you what they need. So I think that that part is important.
0:15:00.0 Everett Sands: Yeah. And now a quick word from Lendistry's boss, our customer. We'll be right back.
0:15:09.2 Tracy Ryan-Johnson: I'm Tracy Ryan-Johnson. I am a certified arborist. I'm the president of Bay Cities Tree Preservation. The wildfires severely impacted our business because we're based in Pacific Palisades. We got out of there very early in the morning on the day of the fire, January 7th. We lost our parking, we lost our base of operations, and we lost almost all of our clients' homes, and that would have been our fall pruning, winter pruning, busiest season coming up. The Small Business Disaster Recovery Grant really helped us get back on our feet. One result of the grant is that it allowed us to open up a new focus, which is wildfire defense strategy with landscaping. We don't want to have a similar situation happen again, and canopies of trees are good, big oak canopies, redwoods, native trees are what we're looking for. The grant really helped us by getting us back to work as fast as possible so that we could go back to helping our clients and start this rebuild.
[music]
0:16:07.8 Everett Sands: Alright, so we just talked a little bit about partnerships, talked about new partners, talked about being in the community and different things like that. I guess one of the things that you have to be careful of is another partner trying to leverage you and your brand and what you guys represent. How do you navigate that?
0:16:25.5 Andre Johnson: It's always a challenge because it's always prevalent. It's... Can't escape it. 90% of the people, especially the inbound opportunities, they always know, hey, I know I benefit from being a part of the Magic brand. So here's all the ways that you can help me and achieve the goal. Sometimes it's just the dance of conversing, getting outside the office, let's have a conversation.
0:16:55.7 Everett Sands: Seeing if they're real.
0:16:56.6 Andre Johnson: Exactly. Some of it, at least for me, where I've found the best way to do that is generally just casual. I take people sometimes to sporting events.
0:17:10.2 Everett Sands: Yeah. To see how they interact.
0:17:11.7 Andre Johnson: To see how they interact. Is it flowing? What's the opportunity? Just kind of gauge it outside of the business walls. Because sometimes it's easy to say all the right things with Mr. Johnson in the room, right? This is your first opportunity to engage with him, excited about an opportunity. But now when he's not there, now let's have a real conversation. Let's see what we can or can't do.
0:17:37.1 Everett Sands: I won't ask you your favorite partner because that might get you in trouble.
0:17:40.7 Andre Johnson: No trouble, please.
0:17:43.1 Everett Sands: But what's your favorite investment? Which might get you in trouble too, but let's hopefully.
0:17:51.3 Andre Johnson: No, you know what? Honestly, I have to say I'm a Dodgers fanatic and I have been since I was a kid. So biased, I would say that. But if I take that hat off and just look at it from a non-biased perspective, the Washington spirit.
0:18:07.8 Everett Sands: Interesting.
0:18:08.4 Andre Johnson: The Washington Spirit.
0:18:09.3 Everett Sands: Why did you choose that one?
0:18:10.7 Andre Johnson: Because having an opportunity to meet and talk to Michele Kang and really hear her passion for empowering women athletes. And even from a health perspective, how they're training, what they're eating, giving them the best facilities. And we have daughters that play sports. So it's like engaging with a leader who's looking at that from a global scale and then wants to scale women athlete empowerment in health and wellness across the board. Can't help but get excited about that. And I love soccer too. So it's kind of like my daughter grew up playing club soccer before she switched to volleyball. So there's a soft spot in my heart for women's soccer.
0:18:53.0 Everett Sands: You've been around the NBA. The WNBA is like on fire.
0:18:56.6 Andre Johnson: And it's booming.
0:19:00.2 Everett Sands: How are you thinking about it? Just curious.
0:19:01.5 Andre Johnson: It is so cool to see because, again, like being here young when a WNBA first started and watching Lisa Leslie and Sheryl Swoops and my girl Tina Thompson. TT, what's up TT? Do their thing. And you look at how the stands were empty and all the things that they try to do to get people to come out and support. And so fast forward to now you go to crypto and it's packed for the Sparks games. And there's a DJ and people are getting up dancing. Celebrities are all sitting on the floor now. It's just such a cool thing to see.
0:19:37.9 Everett Sands: Yeah.
0:19:38.3 Andre Johnson: And to see now that there's a pathway that's not necessarily you leave college, you go play overseas in the offseason because there's not enough money in the WNBA. Now these college athletes with NIL making multi millions of dollars in school. So then that transitions into WNBA Unrivaled. You know, such an amazing thing to see and the growth and success of that league. And sort of in tandem with the WNBA. It's an exciting time for women's basketball.
0:20:11.5 Everett Sands: It's weird to me because it's like I tend to think of sports as already gone through its industrial age. Right. And hockey, unless you're going to create a new sport, like I think Ultimate Frisbee or some... There's sports that have kind of caught on as new. But interestingly, I look at the WNBA as like the balance of old. We know the sport.
0:20:31.0 Andre Johnson: Right.
0:20:31.4 Everett Sands: But like this newness and as a small business that doesn't... I can't compete with a lot of the large brands, so to speak, in terms of advertising dollars.
0:20:40.4 Andre Johnson: Yeah.
0:20:40.8 Everett Sands: But I look at the WNBA as like an easy path. And I would argue volleyball is coming up as well. I would argue that soccer, especially once FIFA hits, I think anybody that wants to invest in sports, now's that time.
0:20:55.1 Andre Johnson: For sure.
0:20:55.9 Everett Sands: It's just so interesting. What I like about what you all are doing is to me, you see the vision, like even the Commanders. I mean, I'm a Commanders' fan, full disclosure. But what a great bet. And I don't know if you guys thought it would turn around in a year or whatever, but it turned around so quickly. Right. The Dodgers, there's been a significant amount of money spent, but same. I don't necessarily know that it's a turnaround because they were always close, but still very good investments.
0:21:21.5 Andre Johnson: Definitely. The turnaround happened early on because of the TV rights deal.
0:21:26.9 Everett Sands: Right.
0:21:27.8 Andre Johnson: So the team, to your point, traditionally was good but then TV rights deal got better. You're spending more money to get different players to get better ultimately to make it to World Series and win it in 2020.
0:21:42.9 Everett Sands: We know that MJE has invested in several kind of big name things. But as you look up on the horizon at either industries, this is specifically maybe related to sports, but it could be others. Where are some of the new opportunities, or opportunities maybe someone who's thinking about investing, or like what we did as we partnered with the Sparks and we partnered with FC Gotham, where are some of those industries where you think there's some kind of hidden gems, and maybe even lower price points, because maybe everybody can't invest in the Dodgers or Commanders.
0:22:15.0 Andre Johnson: That's true. The low-hanging fruit for some investing of tomorrow and immunity opportunities is really around small either, I guess it can be a combination of both, STEM slash gaming facilities for young people. Because the growth of AI opportunities, gaming's not going to slow down. You think about all the studios and people who have IP, they're now trying to get the gaming audience.
0:22:48.1 Everett Sands: That's right.
0:22:49.1 Andre Johnson: So I think the more that we can help young people see a pathway along those things, then we'll start to see some of the great inventors of tomorrow or small business owners, because now there's so many pathways, whether it's STEM, is AI, there's drone technology, there's music that's a part of that, sports. AI is going to participate, and we've seen some AI overlays with companies like Genius Sports. So I think that is sort of the look where are the next wave of opportunities between STEM, AI, culture, and sports and what's the merger of those things.
0:23:31.7 Everett Sands: I gotcha. I tend to think of you guys as what I'll call PE investors, so bear with me. I think of investing like Friends and Family, or Your Own Money, then I think of VC, that gets you to the MVP, the Minimal Viable Product, and then I tend to think of you all as once something's launched and it's pretty successful. Am I thinking about you right?
0:23:50.5 Andre Johnson: That's correct. Traditionally, MJE has been Series A slash Series B investing.
0:24:00.4 Everett Sands: That makes sense. That makes perfect sense. How about in sports, where do you see some hidden gems either in the type of sports, the industry? I know you can't tell us, hey, invest in this next WNBA team. You can tell me that after the tape.
0:24:15.4 Andre Johnson: We'll do that one off camera.
0:24:16.2 Everett Sands: Yeah. Tell me where you think there's some opportunities if you were thinking about different kind of sports.
0:24:21.9 Andre Johnson: I think if it was me, I would definitely look at the growth of volleyball and sort of, you see the league, the Love League that's out there, then the league that Kerry Walsh Jennings is working on. I think the growth of sports is specifically for women too, it's going to come through these volleyball leagues because the NWSL continues to grow, WNBA continues to grow and do bigger things. I think the natural progression is going to be volleyball because there's still more women's volleyball scholarships given out on an annual basis than any other sport.
0:24:58.1 Everett Sands: Interesting.
0:24:58.7 Andre Johnson: So when you think about what's the next step for these ladies who have a tremendous college volleyball career, what's the opportunity for them to go next?
0:25:08.7 Everett Sands: That's interesting.
0:25:09.6 Andre Johnson: So I think the more that people start to look at these leagues and whether it's investment in those leagues or coming up with a compatible league, I think that'll definitely be the growth as to where people should look.
0:25:22.3 Everett Sands: Got it. Got it. Appreciate that. So LA's your home, but how much do you think location matters when you think about these different investments? I mean, if you're in Michigan, it might have been a different story. Not that it's not a good market. Detroit is a different market, right?
0:25:37.4 Andre Johnson: Completely different.
0:25:38.1 Everett Sands: And you have the experience of dealing in different markets. What would you tell to the business owner that's thinking about where they should put their money and where they should put their investments?
0:25:46.5 Andre Johnson: I think now when you look at markets like Detroit, it's turning around a lot. The Pistons are getting better. The Lions have gotten better. The NFL draft was there.
0:25:58.1 Everett Sands: Yes.
0:25:58.5 Andre Johnson: Right. So you think about the economy and how it's thriving there. And then now there are a lot of entrepreneurs who said, similar to the WeWork Model. Buying these abandoned warehouses and then parcel it out to fashion designers, IT services.
0:26:16.2 Everett Sands: Create a space and common kitchens, all that.
0:26:18.1 Andre Johnson: So now it's the creative market for places like that is thriving. So I would say, depending on what industry you want to be in it might make sense to look at a Detroit before you look at LA because LA, in my opinion, for something like that, the market's saturated.
0:26:36.3 Everett Sands: Absolutely.
0:26:37.0 Andre Johnson: So now places like Detroit or places like Atlanta, there's a lot more opportunity for growth.
0:26:42.0 Everett Sands: Makes sense.
0:26:43.0 Andre Johnson: So it's a good thing from a creative perspective, entrepreneurial perspective. I think with sports, it's still kind of market driven.
0:26:52.9 Andre Johnson: You know, you look at the Lakers are going to be the Lakers no matter what. The Knicks and the Yankees, they know these brands all over the world.
0:27:01.5 Everett Sands: Totally right.
0:27:02.0 Andre Johnson: Like the Knicks haven't won in how many years? And they're still always in the top 10 franchises global, like for revenue.
0:27:11.0 Everett Sands: Going back a little bit to like the Dodgers or think about the women's basketball, leading these teams through change, right? Whether it be on kind of the, what I call the local business level or a bigger team, how do you think about leading through change or sharing the time that you've been through change? Anything like that, that you've seen that you're like, hey, you need a couple, I'm making this up, a couple of things that you need when change, you're trying to bring about change.
0:27:33.9 Andre Johnson: Yeah, I would say on the sports side with women specifically, once we saw the Las Vegas Aces win championships, teammates happy, organization is happy. But think about it, it was all based on got top notch facilities, you have chefs, you have good housing. So it's like, when you think about at its core, giving the players and the staff things that they need to empower them, but also to like, have a good work-life balance and be happy about what they're doing, then that affects the organization from the top down.
0:28:11.8 Everett Sands: And how would you translate that to like the smaller businesses? What's their version of the same thing?
0:28:16.4 Andre Johnson: I think their version of that would be kind of, again, leading by collaboration and creating a really good working environment.
0:28:25.6 Everett Sands: Makes sense.
0:28:26.3 Andre Johnson: Because when you do that on a small business side, whether you have 10 employees or 100, right? When people are happy and feel good about where they're coming, and their office looks good, the interactions are good, people are empowering each other, helping each other. It just makes a big, big difference. And that's something that doesn't cost money. It's just something you can do.
0:28:46.0 Everett Sands: When you think about the ACEs, or you kind of mentioned this in terms of crypto, how does like community kind of play a role? So what I mean by that is, how do you think about kind of getting the feedback from the community or feedback from the players as you're thinking about that change?
0:29:05.0 Andre Johnson: I think specifically the community part is important because that has to do with the businesses and housing market around that community, right? So putting a 50,000 square foot facility, where is it going? Are there houses that you have to tear down to put it there? What are the businesses that can participate and sort of you can partner with to increase the revenue for those business owners? So it all comes down to the community at that point, because if you're going to knock down five generations worth of houses, that community probably is not going to want you to come there.
0:29:46.0 Everett Sands: That's right.
0:29:46.5 Andre Johnson: With no benefit to them.
0:29:47.6 Everett Sands: That's right.
0:29:48.1 Andre Johnson: So I think from that perspective, always engaging with the community about things that can help them. And especially when you think about there's a lot of mom and pop, I'm talking about small business owners. In today's market, that's the growth of the economy in the country.
0:30:05.7 Everett Sands: You're right.
0:30:05.5 Andre Johnson: You know, growing up in Michigan, there's a lot more middle of America than it is high-end places.
0:30:12.1 Everett Sands: That's exactly right.
0:30:13.2 Andre Johnson: So always just engaging and making sure the community is thriving, then everything else works.
0:30:18.3 Everett Sands: Yeah, and I think the translation to some of our small businesses is there's a lot of people that have great products or great service, but they're not necessarily getting the customer's feedback. And so it translates for them with an inability to sell the product, right? To your point they're going in and they're disrupting something. They haven't got the feedback. They haven't got the whiff on what's in it for me, for the customer. And then it doesn't translate into sales. And they're like, how? I have this amazing thing. And what we're trying to guide them on is, yeah, but either nobody knows about it, so there's no marketing. Or two, you didn't engage. Like, you didn't confirm...
0:30:57.3 Andre Johnson: Any part of what the community likes. Like, we experienced that a lot in the gaming space. And I actually like that part. Because when you're making a game, you start with an MVP. So you build a small vertical slice of the game. Is it playable? Okay, everything makes sense. And then you move into what we call the alpha stage, which is you might let in, let's just say, 500 people to 1,000 people to try it. And then provide the feedback. Hey, what do you like? Is there anything we can do better? What didn't you like? What wasn't working? So then you take that feedback, iterate, make it better, then you move to the beta space. Then you open it up to a little bit broader of an audience. The same thing. So it's just constantly receiving that feedback to make it better, tweak it, and then put it out wide.
0:31:47.8 Everett Sands: So here's what's crazy. We'll have someone that'll apply for financing, and they think of it as very transactional. And our team will say, hey, so you have a coffee shop? Who's tried your coffee? And they'll be like, what do you mean? I have the best coffee. Who told you it was the best? How many surveys did you get? Did you do any sampling of the coffee? And they're like, why are you asking me that as a finance company? And I'm like, rule number one is pay me back. Rule number two is don't forget rule number one. So I'm asking you to make sure you can pay me back, that people like your coffee. Right. But it's surprising how many people don't get that connectivity to the customer. You know what I mean? And then they're surprised that a finance company is asking them that question.
0:32:25.8 Andre Johnson: You have to pay me back.
0:32:26.8 Everett Sands: That's right. But, I mean, to your point, it's such a good lesson learned. Again, whether it's video games or whether it's building a sports arena, like you gotta get that feedback. And you gotta get it early, right? Not when you're borrowing money and not when you put yourself in debt.
0:32:42.9 Andre Johnson: Right. And be able to listen and take that feedback and, in some cases, constructive criticism, right?
0:32:50.1 Everett Sands: Yeah, absolutely.
0:32:51.0 Andre Johnson: But, like, actually listen to it.
0:32:52.8 Everett Sands: Yeah. Alright, now, last question. In some of your sports, a wild card, let's take the Commanders. That will probably be an away game, potentially. In baseball, though, you know you get some home games. As an executive, are you paying attention to it, literally, to that kind of minutiae?
0:33:13.2 Andre Johnson: Yes.
0:33:13.9 Everett Sands: Interesting.
0:33:14.7 Andre Johnson: Yes. But let me not say just from an executive standpoint. Like, some of that, too, is executive and sports fan, right? Like, as a sports... It's like, they're one and the same, so now you pay attention to the minutiae of those types of things. And baseball is a long game.
0:33:32.1 Everett Sands: Yeah.
0:33:32.4 Andre Johnson: I mean, it's 120 games. So, it's like, every little advantage that you can get helps.
0:33:40.2 Everett Sands: That's right.
0:33:40.7 Andre Johnson: But, to your point, football is different because an away game and playoffs, home team normally has the advantage.
0:33:47.7 Everett Sands: That's right.
0:33:48.2 Andre Johnson: But Commanders went into home field last year.
0:33:51.9 Everett Sands: Yeah. They kind of proved that wrong a little bit.
0:33:54.4 Andre Johnson: It was their time. It was their time. So, it was good to see them do their thing and kind of disprove that a little bit.
0:34:01.3 Everett Sands: Totally right. Totally right. Well, Andre, it's been a pleasure.
0:34:03.7 Andre Johnson: Yeah, the pleasure is mine. Thanks for having me.
0:34:05.2 Everett Sands: Thanks for being on the show and looking forward to future conversations. Thanks for hanging out with us on Small Business Unscripted. Head to smallbusinessunscripted.com for episodes, helpful resources, and to keep the conversation going. Follow Lendistry, that's L-E-N-D-I-S-T-R-Y, on all major platforms. See you next time.